10 yr old asks everyday

[moods]

My name is Gary, the proud father of a 10 year old. She is brilliant if many ways. Great student, talented gymnast, beautiful (Proud dad bragging).


But everyday comes the question, "Are you sure?" This is our shorthand for, "Are you sure I am not going to throw up?" I assure her that I am sure she isn't. She seems to move on with her day. She asks this question 5 to 8 times a day.


She has only thrown up 3 times in her short 10 years on this planet. I tried the logical, that is every 3.33 years, you have 1.66 years left before you might...


I have tried threatening her with syrup of ep..., just to show her it isn't too bad. Naturally this is an empty threat, I would NEVER do this.


I have tried telling her that there are usually many other symptoms that goes along with the potential of tossing, she then started to "feel" these other symptoms.


So far, this fear hasn't kept her from doing things like sleepovers, but I am concerned. She has a week long space camp coming up with her 5th grade class and I fear she will potentially miss it. She is seriously scared. I can see visible shaking.


We have an excellent psychologist, but I am hesitant to subject a 10 year old to therapy.


Is there anything anyone could recommend?


A very concerned daddy,


Gary

[stephiewephie05]

My name is Gary, the proud father of a 10 year old. She is brilliant if many ways. Great student, talented gymnast, beautiful (Proud dad bragging).


But everyday comes the question, "Are you sure?" This is our shorthand for, "Are you sure I am not going to throw up?" I assure her that I am sure she isn't. She seems to move on with her day. She asks this question 5 to 8 times a day.


She has only thrown up 3 times in her short 10 years on this planet. I tried the logical, that is every 3.33 years, you have 1.66 years left before you might...


I have tried threatening her with syrup of ep..., just to show her it isn't too bad. Naturally this is an empty threat, I would NEVER do this.


I have tried telling her that there are usually many other symptoms that goes along with the potential of tossing, she then started to "feel" these other symptoms.


So far, this fear hasn't kept her from doing things like sleepovers, but I am concerned. She has a week long space camp coming up with her 5th grade class and I fear she will potentially miss it. She is seriously scared. I can see visible shaking.


We have an excellent psychologist, but I am hesitant to subject a 10 year old to therapy.


Is there anything anyone could recommend?


A very concerned daddy,


Gary

well, i'm 17 & my parents first sent me to a counselor when i was 8. that was when this fear first started for me. i'm glad that they did, because now i'm going regularly & am getting better a day at a time. by the way welcome to the site!Edited by: stephiewephie05

[sage]

Gary,


If you have an "excellent psychologist" - are you referring to yourself and your wife? If so, then spend some time with him or her discussing how to best deal with your daughter, rather than sending her. When a child is displaying symptoms of emotional distress, usually it is a result of anxiety in the whole family that's getting channeled her way. Sometimes this family anxiety even goes back a generation (it's in your family of origin). When a parent begins to "focus" on a child, and the child displays problems, believe it or not the parent calms down (cuz they say "ok, there's something wrong with my child") Then the child senses the parent's lessening of anxiety when she has symptoms, and so the cycle continues.


Sorry - you probably have no idea who I am - but I'm doing a Ph.D. in psychology, am a completely recovered emetophobe, and I am a specialist in Family Systems (Bowen) Theory.


I may have been confusing...but the point is that if you and your wife can work on YOURSELVES and your own anxiety level (in general - I'm not talking about a disorder) and you can stop focussing on your child (fussing, worrying, answering her questions), then her symptoms may actually disappear. YOUR WORRY can actually cause her anxiety disorder.


At any rate, talk to your own psychologist about this - he or she may not be familiar with Bowen theory - but even so, he/she'll have other ideas that will help you help your child.


Good luck!

[SimplyMe]

hi, Gary and welcome to the site. I remember asking my Mom constantly! Our "code" was "Swear?" And he would and I'd ask an hour later, before going to bed, school, eating etc. I agree that since you have an excellent psychiatrist speaking w/ them about your daughter and what steps should be taken would be best. You do seem to be an understanding and loving parent which makes a whole world of difference I think. I dont' know how I would have been had my Mom not been supportive. So if you get some ideas from your psychiatist about the best ways to handle her and continue to be supportive (even if it doens't always appear that way to her like if you tell her she can answer that question for herself) she will be better off for it. good luck! [img]smileys/smilies_04.gif[/img]

[giff1949]

Gary,


Welcome to this site.


It is great that you are so concerned about your daughter that you want to get some help now. Left unchecked it can completely take over and consume a person's life.


I agree that you should talk to your psychologist about this situation. If my parents had tried to get some help for me when I was ten I would probably be a whole lot better off now.


I have had this phobia a VERY long time and no one tried to help me with it (probably because nobody knewor cared to acknowledge it). My parents SHOULD have noticed signsof anxiety from me because they WEREdefinitly there. No one ever thought that it was really a problem and it grew and grew.


You will notice if you browse around here very long that most of the people are very young. We have lots of teenagers and young adults on this forum. Many of them say their parents can't afford to check on therapy for them or for various other reasons, it is not available. Since you do have the psychologist (already on board, it seems), I would definitly discuss this phobia with him/her and see how you can best deal with it.


Best of Luck!Edited by: giff1949

[izzybee]

Hi welcome to the site. My phobia started to affect me most when I was around the 9-10 mark. i'm 15 now. Its great though that she is still going out and leading a normal life. Is she concerned about the trip? How do you feel she'l cope? I understand your concerns about therapy. Maybe you could try a counsellor first. They tend to be less intimidating and will get your daughter talking about whats wrong, I would personally wait before you try to get her cured as it can be a draining process and quite scarry for someone at that age.


As others have said I would talk this through with the psycologist that you are seeing. They will know your situation and will be able to advise you on what to do next.


Good luck with everything

[confused]

Hi Gary!


"I have tried threatening her with syrup of ep..., just to show her it isn't too bad."


Here's a tip. Don't ever ever EVER under any circumstances threaten an emet regarding throwing up. It will only make things worse. Trust me. I've had emet as long as I can remember (I'm 20 now) and any time I was really really scared I might be sick and someone told me just to do it, or they threaten to make me throw up, I would panic so much more. All that happends is that you make the person SO much more afraid. I know you are just trying to help, but reassuring her she won't does much more. Good Luck with your daughter!!


Danielle

[Louise]

Awwww i think it's so sweet of you to be so concerned!





I'm nearly 16, and i've lost count of thenumber of times i've thrown up... perhaps about once every 2 yrs??? ok thats doesn't seem that much, but i used to be sick alot as a kid!


you need to reassure her not to panic when she thinks she feels sick, as that will make it much worse! Also, buy her lots of minty chewing gum, or minty sweets... that will be doing her a favour!

[sage]

I don't necessarily agree with Louise...the constant reassurance might be the problem in the first place (and I think we all know here that constant reassurance doesn't really help in the long run). HOWEVER I do agree totally with "confused". Don't EVERY THREATEN. Ipecac/vomiting will make your daughter worse - it will traumatize her, and your idea will backfire. Go with talking to the psych.

[moods]

Wow, what a group of concerned friends. Thank you.


I should clarify a few things.


The psychologist. This is an expert child psychologist (not for my wife or I). We were initially introduced to her because as first time parents, we thought our daughter was a genius. Not knowing (being first time parents), we had her checked out. Yes, she did score genius level. It was reassuring that we were right. I am sure the psychologist would meet with my wife and I. This is probably the first step.


The syrup of ep... I would NEVER do this. I just trying to share my frustration and the fact that I have tried many many many tactics. Please be sure, we would NEVER do this.


My wife and I CONSTANTLY reassure my daughter. I want to thank everyone for helping me to understand to continue to support my little girl.


Iam a little frustrated with SAGE's comments. What grade are you in school? How old are you? Do you ahve a family? Your comments sound like alot of theory and not a lot of practical experience. Sorry. As a moderator to a chat room, you might want to reconsider your strong "professional" opinions.


Thanks for the minty gum suggestion. She does mention her throat "tastes" weird.


As for sleepovers and the big trip. While she is concerned, so far so good. She is going.


Thank again to everyone with the excellent thoughts.


Gary

[sage]

Moods,


As I said in the previous post, I'm just finishing my Ph.D. in psychology (all done but dissertation)- I guess that's like grade - 24??? I also have a history of emetophobia which was incredibly severe, but has been completely successfully treated. I hang around here to help others as best I can. I'm 45, have been married for 24 years, and have 3 children (an adopted son, 30, and two daughters 21 and 19). I do work as a counsellor (for 20 years), and specialize in Family Systems Theory. Most of my work is in grief and crisis, but I do a fair bit of couples and family work too.


I hope my comments are helpful to you, rather than frustrating. But thanks for saying they're strong professional opinions - indeed I am both strong and professional. As for thinking I don't have any practical experience - you couldn't be farther off.


Again, as I stressed, by all means, ask your child psychologist for advice that is specific to you. Anyone on the internet can only help so much, and if you have a child psychologist at your disposal, he or she will be your best resource. We're here because we've all "been there", and speak from that perspective.Edited by: sage

[moods]

Thank you. This helps me understand your perspective. I apoligize if I offended you.


AGain, thanks to everyone.

[izzybee]

Please tell us how you are doing and how your daughter copes with this trip. I'm sure we'd all love to hear how she's doing

[missgoddess]

one thing that i think was important for me was being pushed to do things...like if i got scared b4 going to a skool disco my parents would push me to go because they knew i wanted to really but was just nervous about being ill...i feel if they didnt do this my childhood would have been awful, now i have the power to push myself to go to places...so if shes nervous about the trip try and keep her calm, give her tips on how to stay relaxed but make sure she doesnt back out

[Jenneh]

im with missgoddess on this one. i think its very important to push little children into things like that, altho obviously not if they get really distrsessed about it.


i wasnt pushed to things because my parents made me as they knew i was just frightened of being ill, casue at the time they didnt know about the phobia. instead i was pushed because i didnt want neone to find out, so i pushed myself sumtimes, not all the times, but most the time. and im kinda glad i did tht, otherwise i'd be even more housebound and the phobia wud hav a even greater grasp on me.


Jen xxxxxxxxxxx


and yes, i'd like to kno how it goes with ur daughter, altho i donthav ne useful advice sorry

[sage]

No offense taken, Moods - what with all the changes to the site I temporarily forgot who's who...almost everyone here knows who I am and my background, and I should have explained better seeing as you really are a newbie (the new site has EVERYONE as "newbies"!)


The idea of "pushing" a kid really is a good one. It means you're forcing her NOT to avoid. Avoidance is what makes an ordinaryfear into a horrible phobia. If you avoid, it feels better...so your brain goes "hey, that's a good idea - if I'm REALLY scared the next time, it will lead me to avoid again." And if you give into that, (your brain I mean) then your avoidance feels even MORE better...so the cycle begins that leads to extreme terror.


The trouble with emetophobia is that avoidance is normal, because not vomiting is normal. The irony is that we fear what almost never happens. But because it almost never happens, we fear it! I believe this is why it is such a serious phobia.

[missgoddess]

whats dumb is if i need to be sick i can do it happily...am i the only emet who is like this? and unlike most emets i have been sick hundereds of times...i havent been ill for a while but if i have flu or a bad cough it happens, i get sad but i get over it...its the nervie, ill feeling i cant cope with


the other thing about pushing ur child is if they get their own way and dont go to say a meal or sleepover they may feel relieved at first but when they hear all these stories off their mates they will resent the fact they never went and perhaps even u

[moods]

Pushing my child. That reminds of a story. Not much related, but fun.


See there is a clown slide at Disneyworld attached to the Boardwalk hotel/villas. My daughter G (the one with emet) was tall enough to go, but was scared. I didn't "push" her. All she did for the next year was talk about the clown slide. So we went back the following year (we own a time share). Gues what?


Yes, she gets to the top with me. And stops. No daddy. I am not going. Starts to turn around and climb down the ladder. Remember, we are very high up, wet, with a wind blowing, I am cold, shivering, this kid has talked constantly about this moment.


I give the lifeguard the "Daddy is about to toss the kid in the clown slide look."


The lifeguard acknowledges me.


I grab her and toss.


She is sitting, mouth wide open, hands clinched on the rails, the entire trip. She lands in moms arms waiting at the bottom. And SHOUTS, "I want to do it again."


I spent the next 45 minutes going up and down the clown slide, FREEZING!


And yes, I did get in trouble from my wife.

[missgoddess]

lol thats the idea!! u sound like my dad...it is emet related cuz its emet that stops kids from doing fun stuff like that...one thing tho...I WANNA GO ON THE CLOWN SLIDE [img]smileys/smilies_06.gif[/img]it sounds like fun

[snowgirl]

Hello Moods,


It sounds very familiar to me "promise me, swear". I still say that to my mother and I am 25 years old. What I have noticed that works for me is talking the fear out. Even at the tender age of 10, ask your daughter what exactly scares her about throwing up.Once Iwas been able to face what scares me the most (lack of control) I was able to cope much better. She sounds like she is scared because she is not sure if she will throw up or not. Poor child I feel so sorry for her. I do believe that one can cure themselves with a lot of willpower.


Best of luck.


Snowangel

[stephiewephie05]

Pushing my child. That reminds of a story. Not much related, but fun.


See there is a clown slide at Disneyworld attached to the Boardwalk hotel/villas. My daughter G (the one with emet) was tall enough to go, but was scared. I didn't "push" her. All she did for the next year was talk about the clown slide. So we went back the following year (we own a time share). Gues what?


Yes, she gets to the top with me. And stops. No daddy. I am not going. Starts to turn around and climb down the ladder. Remember, we are very high up, wet, with a wind blowing, I am cold, shivering, this kid has talked constantly about this moment.


I give the lifeguard the "Daddy is about to toss the kid in the clown slide look."


The lifeguard acknowledges me.


I grab her and toss.


She is sitting, mouth wide open, hands clinched on the rails, the entire trip. She lands in moms arms waiting at the bottom. And SHOUTS, "I want to do it again."


I spent the next 45 minutes going up and down the clown slide, FREEZING!


And yes, I did get in trouble from my wife.

that clown slide does sound like fun. was it in the shallow end? cuz i'm not a good swimmer. [img]smileys/smilies_09.gif[/img]

[jaksparowsemet]

gary,


i totally agree with griff1949 that it can take over your daughter's life. trust me it has taken control of mine and its not fun at all. try speaking with your psychologist about treating it early. she may grow out of it but thats what my parents thought. when it seemed i did, it was only that i wasnt verbalizing my anxiety, so keep a close eye on your little girl, that may be what she may do. counseling helps a lot, but im not sure about it with younger children, since they may not understand what the counselor is asking, but dont rule taht possibility out!

[soluene]

Hi Gary!


As everyone has already said - you are such a great parent for wanting to deal with this now. My parents knew I had a problem, but taking their child to a psychologist was pretty taboo in their community.


I just wanted to make a comment:you said sheoften feels like she had a funny or weird taste in her throat or mouth. Based onmy own experience with panic attacks and emetophobia, that funny feeling/taste could be the first sign of panic or anxiety. I think part of the reason that I developed emetophobia was because asa child, I did not understand it when my body entered "panic" phase (the first of which for me was the same strange feeling in my throat as it constricted). Since I threw up so rarely as a child, I began thinking that the funnyanxiety feelings were the same as the funny feeling you get before you v*. I made this association, and taught myself to associate fear with v*ing. Since I had anxiety so often, I ALSO thought that it meant I was going to v* several times a day, even if I was perfectly healthy. So, I hope you find this information helpful. If you think this is the case with your daughter, you might start teaching her to recognize the feelings for what they are - along with recognizing and accepting what her body is going through (rather than letting her body scare her, as it does so many of us).


BTW, let me introduce myself: I am a 29-year-old Master's student (not in psychology or anything related, but I've done my research and therapy for this phobia!), married, no children (working up to that). I've had this phobia as long as I can remember, and have not v*ed in 19 years (knock on wood!). I've been a member of IES for almost 2 years now.


To everyone else: This is PLPT8! I chose a new nic when I started the new forum.

[amychristine]

Garry,


That sounds like me as a child. I would always ask my mother and father if I was going to be sick later. I was even afraid to go to bed at night because I fearedI would wake up sick. Sometimes I would ask as much as ten times a day. I was so afraid. The one thing I can tell you not to do is make empty promises to her that she wont get sick. My parents would tell me thatI wouldnt get sick and when I did get sick(which was rarely ever) it made me fear it even more. I felt like I had no control over it and the fearbecame extreme. Over the years the fear subsided until I had a bout of illness and it returned again. I think you should help your daughter through this and be as supportive as you can be. When or if she ever does become sick than you can give her a positive outlook on the situation and take the best care of her while she's throwing up so she can have a good string attached to the incident.


Oh, and by the way... The stuff that makes you throw up is the worst thing in the world! You suffer alot and are very ill. Most likely your daughter would have a terrible experience with that and it would be devistating. Comfort her if she ever becomes sick. Until then you should seek a counsler to help guide her thru her phobia. I hope this helped. Good luck to you and keep us posted!


~Amy

[kel12347]

Hi Gary, and welcome to the site. I have had emet since age 11. I am now 25, and hold a bachelor's degree and a law degree. I've noticed that a lot of emets are very intelligent. I would not threaten your daughter with ipecac, even if you never plan to administer it. It will scare her more, and possibly cause her to not trust you, possibly thinking that you will give her the ipecac, put it in herfood, etc. Please note that I am sure you would never do this, but emets tend to be rather paranoid about anything regarding vomiting - I know I am.As an aside, inducing vomiting does not cure this phobia. I tried ipecac to cure myself, and it did not help. After taking the ipecac, I threw up eleven times, and my phobia is still at the same level it was at before taking the ipecac. The whole experience was terrifying and traumatic.


One thing you may want to do is help your daughter recognize that the funny throat feeling IS a feeling of panic or anxiety. Help her discover how many times she has had this feeling and hasn't vomited. I know that a lot of members here, including myself, suffer from panic attacks, and a tightness or gaggy feeling in the throat is one of the symptoms. If you can head off your daughter's physical anxiety symptoms now, she may be able to cope with them better or eliminate them completely in the future. In addition, you may want to get some information on relaxation techniques and teach them to your daughter. Nothing overly difficult at her age, but deep breathing and muscle relaxation may help. I wish my parents had realized that I had this phobia when I was your daughter's age. Hopefully recognizing her phobia at her young age will make it easier to overcome.


Soluene - When I first started getting panic attacks, at age 11, the most prominent symptom was (and still is) panic-induced nausea. Why do so many emets have nausea as the primary symptom of panic attacks? My mother has panic attacks, and she is not an emet. Some of her panic symptoms are similar to mine, but she has never felt nauseous from a panic attack. I always thought that the panic attacks came from the phobia, but you brought up an interesting point. Maybe the phobia came from the panic attacks and the overwhelming "panic nausea" that comes with them.....OMG, Pilar, I just realized that's you! Hope things are going well!!


Sage, any thoughts on that?

[soluene]

Hi Kel!


That's a good question, I don't know why so many emets have nausea as the first sign of panic attacks - if it IS nausea. I read once that emets interpret many things as nausea that non-emets would not, so who knows if that panic-induced state really is "real" nausea, like we think it is.


Interestingly enough, my sister also gets panic attacks. She is not an emet, but she does fear having ananaphylactic allergy reaction to food. When she panics, she thinks she can't breathe instead. I wonder if that is the same thing as us thinking we are going to v*?

[Lauralye]

Wow, Gary,


That is such a coincidence!!!! When I was younger I would ask my mother "Are you sure"" all the time. Everywhere I went!!! That is so weird that someone else would do that!! I thought I was the only one! I am 18 now and it has subsided a bit. I see that you have gotten alot advice already, I hope it has helped! I jjust wanted to let you know that I did that "Are you sure " thing too!


thankyousomuch,


-Laura

[sage]

I'm not really sure it IS nausea...but I'm musing along with the others. I do remember this feeling...WELL...and I do know now that there was nothing wrong with my stomach.


I guess it's a sort of vicious cycle. People without emet may indeed realize they feel "funny" just like they do when they're sick, but since they're not afraid of THAT they just don't focus on it. They might be more worried about a heart attack, for instance. But for us, once we THINK we're nauseous, then we REALLY panic, then we feel MORE like that, then we panic more...etc. etc.


The trick for me was to realize and absolutely CONVINCE MYSELF that I was not in fact nauseous, and wouldn't vomit from this feeling. I practiced thinking about being home alone in my living room curled up by the fire. (For me, the terror/"nausea" only happened in public). I realized - hey - if I were HOME I'd be fine right now. Even when I went there in my mind for just a moment, the 'nausea' got better. And a light bulb came on - HEY! - I'm not sick!


That light bulb just got brighter and brighter the more I worked on it.


Once you can separate the panic from actual sickness, you're half way there. As Pilar said in another post, the point is that you'll only vomit for 30 seconds every 20 years. So why ruin every minute of every day with worry? Yes, when it happens you will feel horrible - you may even be terrified beyond belief. But why not save your terror for when it actually happens, as opposed to ALL THE TIME.


Sounds easier than it is, of course. But it is possible!

[Ellie]

sage


When you say it like that it sounds so much easier! It makes sense to me what you say! when i do have my panic attacks i AM actually thinking that it's ridiculous what i'm doing.. but for some reason that doesn't help me... i don't know anymore! it's kinda weird.

[pippi]

"are you sure"
If you tell your child that you are sure...what if one day they do get sick and then what? How can you be sure? I see this as allowing. I'm not a professional but I can't imagine this to be a good thing in the case where she actually does get sick.