Schools and handwashing

[paulinek]

My little boy started school yesterday - he's nearly 5. Everythings going great, apart from one thing - handwashing.

Now I know I am more OTT on this subject than other parents due to my emetophobia but I don't think it's unreasonable to expect every child to wash their hands with soap and water everytime they have been to the loo and when the kids in his unit are aged between 3 & 4 (it's a mixed lower and upper foundation unit) I think an adult should be checking on this - or am i wrong here? please be honest.

I asked my son if he had been washing his hands with soap and water and he said there was no soap in the dispenser (which sent my blood pressure soaring!) so yesterday I told him to ask a grown up for help with the dispenser because I'm presuming it's him not using it right rather than it being empty - which he didn't do so this morning I asked his teacher to show him what to do because he can't get any soap out and she said she would, but it's made me realise that no one can be supervising handwashing.

School is SO different to the nursery he went to where a grown up accompanied them to the toilet every time and ensured they followed the "hygiene routine"

[KimberlyP]

I completely agree. When my kids were in preschool and pre-k their teacher had all the children wash their hands when they entered the classroom at the beginning of the day, came back from recess and before snack. One of my kids is basically non-verbal but he sang the hand washing song so many times in those years in her class, he still sings it today when he washes his hands. They never got sick in her class. It was a dream. Wish all teachers did that.

[Razzle]

I'd be mad if they couldn't keep soap in the dispenser. That is carelessness on the teacher's part.

When I was in school we would all line up (from Kindergarten to 2nd grade) right before snack/lunch and wash our hands. My kindergarten teacher would watch us, too.

But to be honest as germaphobic as I am today, back when I was little I didn't understand contamination and germs so most of my school like up til Senior yr of highschool I was pretty unsanitary, hardly ever washed my hands. I have no idea how I did it because I look back and am mortified, lol.

[AoD]

Okay, this probably comes in part from the emet but also (mostly) from my INTJ personality of having a coldly logical outlook on human actions: yes, everyone should be taught to properly wash their hands, from the moment they can actually stand up next to a sink. And proper hand washing technique, with soap and water, should be verified and enforced until it becomes an automatism. The world would be a better place if that was the case. I dream of becoming health minister just so I can tyrannically enforce this in all school programs and offices and brainwash people into washing their hands properly every single time they use the washroom. And closing non-automatic faucets with a clean paper towel to avoid cross-contamination. So that they'd be good little worker bees who don't make others ill with their germy hands full of bodily waste residues. I'd also teach proper disinfection techniques for various diseases and the basics of cross-contamination in the first biology classes. Maybe we could even stop the transmission of stomach viruses altogether with this, if everyone complied.

[kiv91]

I work with 1st graders and idk if its because of my phobia but I make sure my kids all wash hands before lunch after playing outside.

[paulinek]

Glad it's not just me then, sometimes I never know if what I think is reasonable actually isn't and is clouded by the emet iykwim? Like I'd rather poke needles in my eyes than for instance use a petrol pump then eat a bag of crisps without washing my hands first yet I know millions of people do that everyday without giving it a second thought.

Thanks for all your input. I'd LOVE it if everyone washed their ruddy hands regularly, it would bring down illness rates so much for all sorts of things not just tummy bugs.

Yesterday he said no one had shown him how to use the soap so I was all set to have a right go today but luckily for them they remembered today and it turns out the dispenser was too stiff but he knows what to do now. I've spent his whole life drumming it in to him about washing his hands so I don't want school undoing all my good work!

I guess the positive to all this is that he spent 3 days mixing with over 20 3 and 4 year olds without using soap and he didn't get sick.

[Dairyfreelife]

I work with children and schools and with young children they usually do require handwashing after the toilet, before lunch and after playing outside. They encourage it after blowing their noses as well. In my school they encourage the habits and check supplies each evening to refill like paper towels and soap. Love that the school I work in has motion paper towels so don't have to touch after washing hands. But they should be supervising as teachers usually want encourage good hygiene habits.

[Natiebear]

I gave up on the hand washing battle years ago. Our school has hand sanitizer stations all over the school but if my daughter tries to use it she gets in trouble. The reason is they all have to travel down the halls in lines and to reach the sanitizer you have to step out of line. When they step out of line they get in trouble. I just wait for their yearly sv* to hit. It's a battle I gave up a long time ago.

[Jess44246]

Hell, here's a terrifying true story. In my elementary school, we were NOT ALLOWED TO WASH OUR HANDS BEFORE LUNCH!!! My Emetophobia wasn't nearly as bad when I was a little one, but I also look back thinking how I could've ever done that! My afterschool daycare program (bus took about 50 kids from 4 schools to an afterschool daycare center) watched everyone wash their hands once they arrived (right before play time), before snack time (right after play time), and a third time after snack if you had food on you or it was the monthly cooking day (kids make food, mostly cookies). I'm actually going back there to work for them (community service hours give you these special credits) in a year or two, and staying until I graduate and head off to college. My elementary school and my afterschool daycare were complete opposites. And, although it doesn't have much to do with it, in 6 years of school I saw v usually more than once a year where at the afterschool center I never saw v (or even n besides "my tummy hurts from running.)" All you can really do is keep reminding your kid to wash his hands the right way every time before eating. The school may not care much about kids being clean, but at least they do let the kids wash hands before eating, so your son just needs to wash up really well every time. I should also point out that I caught 1 sv my whole time in elementary school.

[Afdpt]

Sadly so many people don't wash their hands properly, or at all. How many times do you see grown adults walk from public restroom stalls and rinse their hands for 3 seconds without even bothering with soap, the rub their wet hands onto their pants to dry them? Or even better, leave the restroom without even bothering to act like they clean their hands... I've learned to not even watch what others do because it would drive me crazy.

I definitely understand your frustration with the school and I agree that everyone should be properly cleaning their hands after using the restroom and again before eating but unfortunately that doesn't happen and will be the case throughout his years of school (thinking back I NEVER had easy access/designated time to wash my hands before lunch period so I just never did it and fortunately illness was still uncommon.)

Just try to do your best to take a deep breath and let it roll off your shoulders. (I know, easier said than done!)

[mamacat]

Oh, I feel this pain. My son's preschool was wonderful about teaching hand-washing. There were sinks in the classroom and they were encouraged to wash hands before lunch, before snack, and of course after using the restroom. And do you know, in the entire time he was in preschool, the only illness my son ever caught was a bad cold that turned into bronchitis? My daughter is in school there now. She has come down with a sv already since starting, but I'm not 100% sure that she caught it at school. I think it's more likely she caught it while out running errands with me on Friday--since she fell ill on Sunday morning, that seems to make the most sense with a 36-48 hour incubation.

Elementary school is so different, though. For one thing, it's a nearly 100-year-old school--which is kind of cool in a way, but the only sinks are located in the restrooms down the hall. My son's K and 1 teachers did not allow the kids to wash hands before lunch, they squirted alcohol based sanitizer on everyone's hands though. He caught *sv once in K and *3* times in 1st grade (it was horrible). This year, thank goodness, his 2nd grade teacher does take the whole class by the restroom before lunch and allows them to wash hands with actual soap and water. Time will tell if this ends up being helpful or not, but here's hoping!

[paulinek]

It should be the LAW to make kids wash their hands after going to the toilet and before eating! It's putting them at risk of getting ill not to do so, and I'm not just talking about tummy bugs but all the other illnesses that do the rounds in schools. Due to him being 4 I can't get a straight answer out of him about whether they are made to wash their hands before lunch or not but it sounds like they may do, when there's a parents evening I'll ask. His nursery was amazing whenever there was an outbreak of noro - they'd take away the sand, finger paints etc and disinfect all the toys and in the almost 4 years he was there he never once caught a sickness bug from there, the only times he ever got them he'd caught one, like mamacat, by working out the incubation time I always worked out he'd got it from just being out and about in the community.

[Syrup]

Yes, my friend's daughter attends a school at which they ONLY use hand sanitizer before lunch in elementary school as well as when they come off of the playground. I flipped out about how dangerous that is, not only is hand sanitizer AWFUL for children but also it does NOTHING to prevent a number of contagious viruses that easily spread through schools (and I'm not only talking Noro). She blew it off but NEWSFLASH, they had a massive Noro outbreak last winter. I don't get it. If we KNOW that washing hands before entering the classroom would cut back on a number of outbreaks throughout the school year WHY wouldn't we do it? It would save government funds as teachers wouldn't be calling in sick, and it would protect students (and parents having to call in to care for their children) health.

When I taught preschool there were no hand washing rules. My class was the ONLY ONE that required every student wash hands before coming into my classroom. The parents knew it and at first were really resistant. I'd stand at the door, welcome them, take their coats, lunch bag, etc. and off they would go with mom or dad to the restroom to scrub up. We did the same before lunch, after playground time and before heading home for the day. NONE of the kids EVER caught ANYTHING from school. The other rooms all had outbreaks, but not mine. The director finally asked what I was doing since my room only ever had one or two absences the entire year. I told him and STILL it didn't become a school rule. Ridiculous.

[paulinek]

Syrup - that's amazing! I wish you were teaching at my sons school. Honestly, handwashing is such a simple thing to do but the benefits in terms of preventing ill health are amazing and the results you had in your room speak for themselves. It can't be nice for staff to deal with vomiting kids so you'd think they would be all over hand washing like a rash to keep their kids healthy.

[Syrup]

It was CRAZY! No joke, out of 7 classes we had a single day which 4 of the classes were closed because of Noro. ALL of my kids were present and healthy. HELLO??? Why would such a simple practice be avoided when trying to maintain good health. That meant that ALL of those parents either had to call in sick or find other childcare for the day. It takes a few SECONDS to stop an outbreak.