For Sage/Anyone who wants to speculate

[stella9]

Hi Everyone,


It is so great to see the sight up and running.


We are all aware that there has been so much media attention given to this year's vicious sv epidemic. All the articles have encouraged hand washing since the virus is known to be spread through the oral route. That said, how on earth is this virus so virulent? As a population, I think we are much more hygenic than in generations past (less the restaurant worker population).


As children, we almost never washed our hands, we sucked our thumbs, bit our nails, Purell and wipes were not available and we rarely got sv and when we did it was v** two or three times and that was it. They called it a 24 hour bug, but we would mend within a few hours and by the next day we were 100%.


Now, kids get sv several times a year with projectile V***, v** 20+ times, hospitalizations, etc. How on earth can this illness not be airborne and still have such virulence?


Stella

[blancfixe]

I'd be curious to know this too, especially since, as I've heard, sv
isn't resistant to purell, etc. Thus, if it's not resistant, it shouldn't be
mutating at the rate of other bacteria. Perhaps the media just uses it
for good stories?

I was telling my mom how I'm NEVER going on a cruise again, and
she brought up the point that a lot of the crew on cruise ships are
people from other countries, countries that aren't as OCD about
handwashing as we are in the US and maybe UK. That could
contribute. (I really hope that didn't come off badly...).

I do remember as a kid that I'd only be sick 2-5 times with the sv,
but I knew people that would get up to like 10. I think my bf
projectiled once too. *shrug.

[sage]

I really do think a lot of it is media hype. Which in a way is a good thing. No wars to report or terrorist attacks, so they have to come up with something to freak people out (that's what gets ratings) so since noroviruses come every year why not focus on that. Our world has also become more of a global village with people travelling relatively cheaply and often, so stuff "gets around" more. That's one reason why I encourage people not to worry about "where" the virus is in the news - all it takes is one person to get on a plane or bus, come to your town, and leave their fecal-infected hand on a doorknob in your mall and you can get it anyway. So despite where it is, the danger to you as an individual is no greater.


As for hygeine, I don't think we're generally very good at is as a population. People who are afraid wash their hands, but people who aren't, which is 99% of the population, don't care as much. The virus is quite contageous (doesn't take many particles to get someone sick) and it mutates every year, so on and on it goes.


Nevertheless, if you examine the statistics carefully over the past 20 years or so, there is some rise in the incidents of norwalk-like viruses, but nothing alarming as the press suggests.

[blancfixe]

Makes sense! In my office, I've noticed that everyone washes their
hands (we share bathrooms with other offices on our floor) - whether or
not the person expects an audience for the handwashing. Or I'm an
optimist....I just thought I see more people washing their hands than I
used to. I very rarely see someone leave any bathroom without doing
it.

[stella9]

Sage,


Your logic makes sense. I agree that all it takes is one person to get off of a plane or bus and put their germ infested hands on something and, voila, the illness is in the new town. Remember SARS in Toronto a few years back? All it took was one person sick person, traveling from Asia,who got off a plane and infected people in a new city. Still, with all the media hype and scare only like 100 people got sick out of city of several million. I don't want to minimize the situation for the ones who fell it, because it had to be horrible. However, the the news made it seem as though the whole population of Toronto was at death's door.


While I feel we are more hygenic, since the Purell seems ot fly off the shelves at thestores, I know there are still people who are not. I can't tell you how often I see people push shopping carts with toddlers sitting in the front eating something that has been handed to them by the parent, who by the way, has had their hands all of the cart handles, freezer door handles, eggs, etc.


Oh well, we can't worry about what others do. We can onlycare for ourselves.


Stella

[andee]

Hi Everyone, I had asked that similar question earlier....and just recently I got to ask my pediatrician if these viruses are worse, or are they the same ones we got as kids??? He said they are pretty much the same, only now with play dates, daycare, etc. kids are together a lot more than in the past. We just hung out in our neighborhood when we were young, but now there is so much more interaction. It does make sense and also reflects what you all said.</font>

[worrygirl]

I was checking outat Wal Mart a month or so ago and there was a lady with her daughter (sitting in a cart) and they were both eating McD's french fries (after having touched who knows what plus the cart handle). I was completely grossed out.


I agree about 20-30 years ago. We did not wash or disinfect our hands at school before eating, parties, etc and we sucked our thumbs. What's up with that???? And Stella you are right, the few times we would get sv* we only v*ed a few times and were better. My dtr at age 6 has had more sv* than I ever did as a kid.

[lgood22573]

About the McD's cart thing. As much as it grosses us out as an emet population, we have to remember-that is what normal people do. People who don't live their lives in fear eat while they are touching and going places. It's a normal thing to do.

I completely here what you are saying, I just wanted to point that out.

[worrygirl]

I know people who are not emets nor germaphobes who think that is disgusting.

[chicajojobe]

I think it's a number of reasons.

I read once that some of the scientific community considers noroviruses to be emerging, so there may be more virulent strains which are showing up. Really, going by the evolutionary definition of virulence, noroviruses are brilliantly adapted. They don't kill the host so they have a source of energy to use to replicate, and, as we all know, they are transmitted fast and easily.

I agree that a big contributing factor is definetly media hype. As a matter of fact, I'm very cynical about how the media reports on disease because I'm convinced they love to scare people, and. as someone who is phobic of diseases, I can't help but be personally offended.
My first encounter with this was West Nile Virus. I only really heard about it from the media, and they made it sound like it was very deadly. Well come to find out that isn't true at all. As a matter of fact, I could have already had it and not realized.
Then last winter when everyone was scared of Avian Flu even my campus newspaper printed misleading headlines such as "Government Prepares for Bird Flu Epidemic." Well the article was actually about what the government was doing to be ready incase it ever does happen, but a headline like that makes it sound like they're expecting it....TOMORROW!


I also agree that things probably haven't changed that much. I'm a bit younger than you guys. I'm only 20 so my childhood was 10-15 years ago not 20-30, and I did all the same things as you guys....nail biting, etc. I was pretty good about washing my hands, but I'm an emet so that's not to be unexpected. However, I didn't get all that many sv's (Hopefully that's a trend which will not change for me as an adult).

I don't agree that people are so much more clean than in years past, though. They just think they are. Everyone uses hand sanitizing gels, wet wipes, and Lysol because those "kill 99.9% of germs".....but not noroviruses. What people don't do more of is the stuff which actually help prevent transmission of sv's. Wash their hands properly with soap and water. I can't name how many times I've seen girls in the bathroom come out of the stall and then leave without ever touching the faucet.

[Babydoll]

I was just going to say that maybe the reason kids are catching Stomach viruses is because of technology. I know that sounds odd, but listen to my reasoning.


I know when I was a kid... it was " play outdoors, get some fresh air" or else!! We spent 75% of our time not in school outdoors. Kids these days are more apt to stay in and play nintendo - therefore being in closer quarters.. and passing on the germs. Also, kids nutrition, on average, is not that great - When I was a kid ( NOT that long ago) a cookie was a treat... now I know familes who let their kids eat like that all day...so yea, I think these things could be contributing. But, the media deffinetly blows things out of proportion.

[calibmom24]

Babydoll... I totally agree with you!!