Why anti-emetics don’t work?

[dktekno]

First I will say sorry for the other post, it was in no way ment to offend anybody.



But I would like to know WHY anti-emetics won't help?

Because, as I see it, it seems like the only way out.



I've been anxious and totally afraid of v* ever since 1997 (I'm 19
now). I've v* 2 times durint this 8 year period. I've also noticed that
the anxity got worse in the months after I v*.



So, I thought if anti-emetics could be useful? You say they aren't but
I would like to know why. If you can not v* then what should there be
to fear?



If stay on the ground and are afraid of getting to the heights, then
what is wrong with staying on the ground? While you stay on the ground,
you aren't afraid of heights, only when you come up there. So, if
you're afraid of heights, just don't go to the heights.



If you are afraid of v* then what is the problem with taking something that prevents you from v*?



Well, this was what my first post (which was locked) was about, but maybe I should have expressed it in another way.



If you find this one offending too, tell me why, because it is not ment offending in any way.



And again: Sorry for the first post.

[crazybeautiful]

So...she locked it for a reason, perhaps you should quit while you're ahead.

[snowangel]

Everyone deserves to be forgiven. I accept the apology.
Anti-Emetics dont work because they are a temporary solution to a permanent problem. They are also not good to take all the time. They have very damning side effects, long term. I was specifically advised by my doctor to stop taking so much gravol (dramamine) which is an anti-emtic.

Plus, by taking anti-emetics you will eventually grow immune to it. This means that when you actually NEED it, it wont work.

I would suggest anti-anxiety pills rather than anti-emet. Rather than trying to prevent actually throwing up, we should try and calm the ANXIETY of throwing up.

Besides, as much as I hate to admit it, when the dreaded day comes that I have to throw up, I dont want to prevent it natural things from happening.

Hope this helps !!

[2jo2]

They won't work for your fear because it's irrational and a mask for some other deeper rooted problem. There is a surgery that people sometimes need for acid reflux disease, it makes a new sphincter at the top of your stomach, making a one-way valve instead of your original two-way valve that you were born with. This surgery prevents you from being able to vomit. The first thought is OMG I want that surgery. But this isn't the answer to your fear. Your fear would be displaced onto something else, you may have a fear that your surgery is going to be the one that doesn't work correctly and you actually can v*, or you may fear eating because of it... there are many different ways, but your root of the fear isn't resolved, it will make itself known another way. Just like obese people getting gastro bypass, some people aren't emotionally ready to quit the overeating that caused them to be obese, they'll still have that urge to overeat. Changes physiologically don't equal changes psychologically. I had a time when I didn't want to leave the house because of this phobia. I have a real contamination issue. Staying in the house isn't going to cure me of my fear of leaving the house, because soon I would fear that germs could get in, they'd come in under the door or on my husband's clothes, on the mail, etc. Your theory of making yourself unable to v* is not the answer. I know these pills you take are your safety blanket, but they are not 100% effective, and are probably harming you. It's just like any other drug, you take too many of them, and they're going to lose their effectiveness. Taking those drugs is not going to make you physically unable to v*.

[madisonsmom]

With that surgery...wouldnt you still have the nausea and just feel like crap? UGH! It sounds good though[img]smileys/smilies_01.gif[/img]


I have never taken anti-emetics. I have had them before when I had food poisoning and was in the hospital but they did not help me. V* isa reflex...there is actually a v* center in your brain located in the brain stem. I guess some people can seriously control it...


I do have phenergan but have never taken it. I feel very anxious if I think I am getting a stomach virus. I will take an anti-anxiety pill and if my nausea goes away I know its not a stomach virus and that its my nerves. If its a virus I have to ride it out.UGH! I hate the though of that[img]smileys/smilies_12.gif[/img]

[stella9]

As for the surgery, I am very knowledgeable about it. My son was
born with acid reflux and it has been horrible. It took a break
until last summer when it returned with a vegenance. The
gastroenterologist said it is common to come back at around 4.5 years
old. My son talkes a Previcid every day and it does not
help. We will find out on 4/6/05 whether he will have the
sphincter surgery which is a one way valve. He will never be able
to vomit. While we think - yeah - there are times when people
have to vomit, which if they can't can result in death. Yes, if
he gets a sv he won't v****, jsut have diarrhea.



Stella

[mitch4133]

I am so sorry your son has to go through that Stella. I hope everything works out for him. Good luck to him and you.


Michele

[shiva]

dktekno...


I am glad that you posted again and I also accept your apologies. Would you really be happy forever being a prisoner to this phobia? Or, being a prisoner to anti-emetics? Firstly, you should give yourself a break and aknowlege that this phobia exists instead of trying to call it something else. It is what it is, and you as well as all of us CAN fight it. As I re read some of your posts, I realized that you are as upset as we are about this daily challenge that we all face. Hey, give yourself a break. It seems you are beating yourself up about stuff and that will get you no where.


Anti-emetics, staying home, not having families, not living... None of these are answers to our hell. The only way we will be better is when we fight this. In order to win the battle you must understand what you are up against. We can all win this. We all have it in us, and by no means does beating this mean running from it.


I hope you continue to come here for support. There are amazing people here. When I see all the strength at this board it sincerely overwhelms me. You will never find more strength and willingness to help anywhere. Everyone here has their own special way of trying to help the other people and you, too will become a part of that. I think that is why I love this place so much.. Whether you need challenged or coddled, or a shoulder to cry on and someone to listen, this board offers all of that and everyone is willing to forgive when the apology is sincere.

[madisonsmom]

Stella-I am sorry your son has that. Its horrible. I am just wondering if you feel worse when you feel like you have to v* and cant. The most important thing though is that he gets better![img]smileys/smilies_01.gif[/img]

[japa]

I was away for the day, but I read most of the other thread. Maybe I am strange, but I don't feel at all offended by dktekno's claim that emetophobia is not a phobia. I think that this controversy has been a difference of opinion, and dktekno never meant any harm. I think that some of us got defensive because we feel comforted by acknowledging our feelings about V as a phobia. dktekno feels more comfortable defining his feelings as rational and non-phobic and has found a solution that works for him. To each his own.


If the label or definition of emetophobia is not useful to someone, maybe it could damage his or her self concept to think in terms of having a phobia. I can understand how someone may not want to consider that he or she is having irrational thoughts about something. I don't think that the rest of us should feel threatened in our belief that this is a phobia just because one person with the samereactions that we have toward V does not want to consider it that way. We can still think as we wish and seek the treatments that we feel are appropriate. If we approach a therapist already defining this as a phobia, I am sure that the therapist will treat it as such if we have met a good and competent therapist. My current therapist is open to understanding life from my perspective, and she listens to things like this. Edited by: japa

[skon]

erm..they worked for me.


Mind you , I didn't use heavy duty ones but you don't really need that...antihistamines are great because they also knock you out a little bit which gets rid of anxiety....at least it did for me.


As long as you don't abuse them, you won't get "immune" to them. I used them just about daily for like a year and each time they felt just as powerful. I don't need them anymore because I was able to get out and do things I normally wouldn't do because I took the antiemetics. Gradually I tried doingthings without taking them, but still took them with me where I went, and after a while I found I didn't need them. Now I don't even take them with me most of the time.


They're not going to kill you, or do anything really...the antihistamines, I mean. People take them daily for allergies....the antiemetic ones are the same thing but in a different package marketed for that particular effect.


I found it useful to shift the goal from "getting over" the phobia to seeing how long I can go and what I can do without using the pills. It took the focus off the phobia. It appears to have worked since I haven't had to use them at all really, for months now.


If you think it will help....try them. It's better than being stuck in this forever just because some think it's not right for them, and they're a hell of a lot less potentially harmful than anti anxiety drugs and antidepressants and stuff like that. Simple things work too.

[hippychick]

Anti Emetics didn't work for me because I was still worrying were they working? or what if this happens you know? My anxiety wasn't actually about being ill it's about being in control and a lot od things that happened in my life and anti emetics did absolutely nothing for me. I took them daily too and when you take something like that daily it does make the effect they have on you less powerful. However I will agree that it helped my anxiety when I was out to know I had them with me. But thats about all! Like I say, what works for one doesn't for another and people should keep an open mind


What I objected to was the claim that it was the only way to get better. When Sage says therapy is the only way I object and when this guy says these are the only way i object becase everyopne is different and there is no one right way t do this, you just gotta try everything.

[ChippedAway]

I wasn't offended about the content, but about the delivery. Nobody here is stupid, or deserves to be called stupid or be cussed at.

[dktekno]

2jo2 - a litle correction: I don't take anti-emetics, but I am really seriously thinking about getting some of them.


What if I only take the pills when I become sick? Don't you then think they will help, by making me unable to v*?


Well, I would still have the nausea, but doesn't there exist pills against that, too?

[sparky2004]

I don't think there is really any 'anti-emetic' pills out there. It is a physchological problem, that has physical manifestaions. Gravol, an anti-nausea pill, and other brand names of anti-nausea pills seem to be, at least for me, the only true means to end sudden nausea. Yet Gravol has side effects, such as drowsiness and it cancause exciteablility in children.


Yet Gravol is only a 'band-aid solution' to a problem that needs to be tackled with professional treatment. Excessive use of Gravol can actually become addicting, and can cause damage if taken over a period of time, such as dependance or immunity or actual addiction to the drug itself.


Depending on the severity of this phobia, emets can find and use a number of different ways to cope and deal with this problem. Coping mechanisms range from natural therapy with Ginger, to professional treatment with anit-depressents. I have also tried many different ways of tackling my emet, such as using breathing exercises, relaxation techniques and the like. I also take Paxil, which is a crutch that I use to help deal with my anxiety.


Yet no pill is going to cure emetophobia. It takes a lot of work on our part emotionally and mentally. Having the right source of supportand access to the proper medicalrescources is also critical in 'attacking the panic attacks' and fear of getting sick itself. Our knowledge about this condition must continue to be expanded, as the more we know about anxiety, panic attacks andemetophobia itself, there is a better chance that we can becomecompletely cured. I believe we can all be cured of this. We all have very similar symptoms and reactions. We just have to know the right way for each of us as individuals. Edited by: sparky2004

[baseballplaya12]

I understand where you are coming from...I think everyone heres life
would be so much better if they had a solution to never have to v
again...but right now this isnt really possible...i think the best thing to do
is to train your mind to realize that being sick is not as bad as we all
make it out to be, and its not worth worrying about everyday and thats
the goal of therapy...so get out there and try therapy instead of medicine
that may hurt you more than its going to help you....and i hate to say it
btu if you need to v than anti-emetics probabaly arent going to do too
much.

[Babydoll]

I agree, i wasn't mad about the content, but the way it was delivered.





I belive we fear vomiting not because its so horrible itself, but because we loose all control of ourselves when it happens, and that, to me is the worst part.Emet is deep rooted, and I reallly belive comes from other things, and everyone has their underlying issues.


one poster was right when she said that pills give us a quick fix, yes, but nothing long term. we may feel satified for the moment but the next time we get nauseated the feeling of panic returns over and over with no long term soltuion. In order to help the phobia, we need to fix what deep rooted problem is the actual cause, and I think the hardest part for most is actually realizing what that problem is, because for most people, its not that clear.


For some, its part of their OCD. for others, it could be fear of abandoment, it could be 1 of 100 things and for some reason we associate Vomiting with that. Like for me, seeing my mother throw up, and in pain, when I was little. when your 5 years old, and you see your world( mother) crying and pleading for her throwing up to stop, it can impact you in ways like this. ofcourse she had no idea it was ever an issue to me, she was just upset at the time.


so you see, the idea of a band aid for a quick fix won't get us anywhere. the goal for us to for one day be okay with the idea of Vomiting, and that means fixing whatever it is we have associated with it.


I'm glad you appologize, and I think that shows good character. I will accept it, but please remember, 1st impressions last forever, and I think we are stillall a bit hurt and mad by what has been said.


we are here to support one another, not to belittle, or critisize them. Its fine to disagree, but please do so with tactfulness.

[spinnerchick]

Are you at all afraid of others v'ing? If so, do you think that fear would simply disappear if you knew you couldn't v yourself? I take dramamine whenever I fly these days(even though I've flown plenty of times without it and never gotten sick) but I'm still terrified that someone else sitting near me might v.

[baseballplaya12]

thats how i am i could care less if other people v as logn as it will not
cause me to v myself...so i understand where dtkeno its coming from..

[jesskali]

I always keep anti-emetics at hand. Phenergan works well for me, but I rarely take it. I do not take it unless I absolutely feel that IT is going to happen. This may sound strange, but I can actually tell when *v* is inevitable. I get this feeling like I've been kicked in the stomach. The thing is, usually by that point it is too late to take an anti-emetic. Anyway, I have to be experiencing extreme nausea before I rely on my Phenergan. As said in a previous post, if you use it too much, it will not work anymore.

The last stomach virus I had, I did not have any Phenergan at home. So, I went to my doctor and got a shot of it--it worked within 5 minutes and I didn't *v* anymore. I still felt crappy, but no n/v! So, now I always have some Phenergan.

[2jo2]

2jo2 - a litle correction: I don't take anti-emetics, but I am really seriously thinking about getting some of them.


What if I only take the pills when I become sick? Don't you then think they will help, by making me unable to v*?


Well, I would still have the nausea, but doesn't there exist pills against that, too?

Please someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think dktekno is overestimating the power of pills. I don't think that by taking them you are unable to v*. Being unable to v* to me means that physically you cannot. I think that you are still able to v* even though you take a pill to stop it. Case in point, when I worked at a pharmacy in college, there were times when people came in and got an anti-emetic and had to come back for a suppository because they were still v*ing even with taking the pill by mouth. Am I way off here? Surely you have the right idea dktekno, that if v*ing didn't exist, my problems wouldn't exist. But our bodies are made with a fail safe that if we get anything bad in our bodies, we need a way to expell it fast. I understand all that, and I have to get that logic into my brain that when I have a trigger for my emet, that I have to trust my body's design, that v*ing isn't bad, it's unpleasant, but it isn't bad or scary. I have the fear of others being sick as well, moreso than myself, even if I can't catch it. So I'm hit from both ways.

[r311dude]

What if I only take the pills when I become sick? Don't you then think they will help, by making me unable to v*?

dktekno, I think you're a little misinformed. Anti-Emet pills don't prevent you from v*. The one's I know of (Xanax being the most common) usually are offered as a mild tranquilizer. What it does is decrease the chance of a panic attack. It does not prevent v* at all. I don't know who told you this, but my doctor has informed me time and time again, when your body needs to v* it will v* because it needs to get rid of whatever is bothering your stomach.


The pills are just there to calm the body down. Because, for me at least, it's not the v* that freaks me out, it's the build-up to it. So when I take my pills it calms me down. Because in reality, I'm not going to v*, it's just my body tricking me into thinking that in the situation I am in that I will v*





I hope that all made sense. LOL =)


LOVE Rich

[r311dude]

Heh, 2jo2, you posted faster than me =( hah.

[mrbleaney]

Vomiting
is controlled by the brain, regardless of the stomach ailment or
whatever that is triggering it, and certain anti-emetics, like
Compazine and Tigan, directly affect the vomiting center of the brain,
and thus, are very effective in the treatment, and indeed, prevention
of nausea and vomiting. I have taken both Compazine and Tigan and, for
me, at least, they worked. Here is a paragraph lifted from the
University of Maryland Medical Center website on the drug</span></font> Trimethobenzamide (Tigan):



</span></font>
<div style="text-align: center;">
<div style="text-align: left; margin-left: 40px;">Trimethobenzamide works in preventing or decreasing hormone (dopamine)
effects on the brain's vomiting center. By decreasing dopamine's effect on the
vomiting center, nausea and vomiting are prevented, decreased, or
stopped.</span></font>



</div>
</span></font></div>
I'm not going to debate whether anti-emetics are the answer to emetophobia--that's up to the individual, but the fact is they do</span>
work, and, for some of us, they are instrumental in managing this
phobia. So, questioning the efficacy of anti-emetic medications or
whatever we use to cope with emetophobia is, I feel, unhelpful and
slightly cruel. I'm sorry if this comes off as being too critical of
this thread, but it touched a sensitive area. Please know that I do
respect all of your opinions.</span></font>

</span></font>

[hippychick]

Anti emetics definately do work! Firstly I know this through my Mum, last year or the year before she had an operation and I posted here that she could not stop V*...I'm not exaggerating! So they took her to the hospital and gave her a shot of an anti emetic, with the first shot the V* decreased SO much...I think she only V* once after the first shot and that was wearing off and with the second shot it was ok again. She was dehydrated so she stayed in a little while but Anti emetics such as Metoclpramide, Compazune etc etc ALL help V* and further more they give these to people having treatment for cancer and the amount of V* with those treatments has decreased considerably.


However I found when I was on them i still panicked...were they working? What if they didn't? What if..... You know? My brain was still anxious. Also taking them everyday on a long term basis will decrease the effect they have on you. But I think it is a good safety to carry some around with you...I just dont think taking one everyday is going to cure emet thats all. I could be wrong but in my expereince it is a short term solution.

[shiva]

I think that probably if you think they will work, they will most likely work and if you are skeptical then they may or may not. Yes, I feel our brains are that powerfull, think of how they control us in this hell everyday.

[hippychick]

I'm not even sure I agree with that since my mum was so sick she wasnt thinking one way or the other you know? She didnt think they could help she was just too ill to even think. I'm not syaing they will alwats work, I'm not saying they are foold proof I'm just saying that they can and do work for those who are saying anti emetics will only make you sleep and not do anything

[shiva]

I guess all I really meant (from that prospective) was that those who think that they possibly will not work will probably still experience nausea since most of us (in my opinion) make our selves feel nausiated many days out of the year for no reason.


But, I am sure that anti-emetics would do their job in most people who use them in moderation as they are prescribed. I think that the possibility would exist to become so used to the medication that it no longer was as effective.


I also feel that any doctor in their right mind would not even consider prescribing anti-emetics for an as needed basis on someone with no physical ailment. However, in this day where doctors get most of their money from pharmacutical companies, it would not suprise me that they do.